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Message started by JEFF1950 on 04/20/13 at 10:41am

Title: Cinema Retro
Post by JEFF1950 on 04/20/13 at 10:41am
Hey you guy's, check out the new issue of Cinema Retro, it has a 12 page article on Straw Dogs, the article is by Mike Siegel and features many photo's from my archive, and Mike's.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Gashade on 04/20/13 at 4:51pm
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Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Novecento on 04/20/13 at 7:14pm
Looks like one to pick up

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by The Dude on 04/20/13 at 7:42pm
Can't wait to get it!

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by mike bishop on 04/23/13 at 10:59am
Yeah, me too :)

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Novecento on 06/02/13 at 10:37am
Got my copy. It's a good one - very nice job Mike and Jeff! Includes a little sidebar on The Killer Elite as well. There's also a couple of (non-Peckinpah) contributions by Howard Hughes in this one who can always be counted on for a great read.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Novecento on 05/09/14 at 11:24pm
Seems like the new issue of Cinema Retro is going to have the following Peckinpah article:

Analyzing Sam Peckinpah's crime classic "Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Garcia".

Mike - does this have anything to do with you?

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by mike bishop on 05/10/14 at 3:03am
you bet :)

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Robert Blenheim on 05/11/14 at 1:08pm
I can't wait!  I have the Cinema Retro issues on Getaway and Straw Dogs.  Are there any more Peckinpah issues in the past?   And when is the new issue due to be available?

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Gashade on 05/11/14 at 8:27pm
Issue 3 has 17 pages on Peckinpah by Mike Siegel. It is the most complete thing they've done about him so far. If you don't have it, pick it up, it's well worth it, and they have a few last copies available.
Issue 7 has an interview with Mitch Brower, the producer of The Getaway, and a piece by Mike Siegel about Peckinpah events in Italy and Israel.
Issue 8 has a nice still from The Wild Bunch and a short piece about Jeff Slater's book "Entered his house justified", with a picture of Sam and a topless Isela Vega from the set of Bring me the head of Alfredo Garcia.
Issue 10 has a 1,5 pages piece by Jeff about scenes from Straw Dogs that didn't make it in the final cut, including the one that ended up on the poster artwork where David threatens the village men in the pub with a rifle. It also has a short piece on Susan George, and The Wild Bunch is included in the top ten best films from 1969.
Issue 14 has the second part of an interview with Ernest Borgnine where he speaks about The Wild Bunch.
Issue 15 has a very short piece about Mike Siegel's documentary "Passion and poetry".
Issue 16 has the third part of an interview with James Caan where he talks about The Killer Elite. It also has an interview with Norman Jewison who took over The Cincinnati Kid from Sam, where Sam is only briefly mentionned.
Issue 26 has a 12 page piece by Mike Siegel on Straw Dogs. The Wild Bunch's score is also a topic in this same issue.
Issue 29 has a 2 pages piece by Mike about Bring me the head of Alfredo Garcia.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Novecento on 05/12/14 at 10:21pm
Thanks so much for the detailed breakdown.

How much details does Caan go into on the Killer Elite in issue 16?

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Gashade on 05/21/14 at 7:02pm

Novecento wrote on 05/12/14 at 10:21pm:
Thanks so much for the detailed breakdown.
How much details does Caan go into on the Killer Elite in issue 16?


Not so much, actually. Here it is:

As a thriller, The Killer Elite works quite well today. It's got a calibre of cast a film producer now could only dream about getting - Caan, Robert Duvall, Burt Young, Bo Hopkins, Gig Young, Mako - a great, if quirky, Jerry Fielding score. And yet, although a considerable hit at the time, it was thought of as lightweight for a Peckinpah film. In truth he was compromised by many factors, not least of which were his own personal demons of drink and drugs, but also because studio chief Mike Medavoy, who was trying to keep a tight leash on his unpredictable director, wanted a mass appeal picture and therefore needed a PG rating for the picture to sell. The initial script, with a secret cadre of black-ops paid assassins entering into a twisting internecine tale of betrayal and revenge, was a fairly straightforward thriller with some in-vogue martial arts sequences to attract the Bruce Lee crowd. However, once the production began, and the suits were at arms length, things began to fall apart, starting with the script, which was more or less abandonned.

At the film's core was the friendship that existed between two of these elite killers, Locken (Caan) and Hansen (Duvall). Their interplay in the opening stages of the film are among the best scenes in it, and the easy camaraderie was not scripted, but sprang from real life incidents. "Me and Bobby, well, for instance, something would happen the night before, my brother would pull some prank at the Hilton or something, and I'd tell Sam, and he's like, 'Tell it to Bobby! Say it like it happened!' And that'd end up in the script! Peckinpah was insane. He'd disappear for days at a time. Sam was just... Sam. He couldn't give a fuck less..."

In fact, it's a miracle the film hangs together as well as it does. In its execution, it seems to constantly be poking fun at itself, with hugely unlikely set-ups, including Burt Young taking on - succesfully - highly trained ninjas whilst exchanging quips with Caan who himself manages to despatch said highly-trained men whilst balancing on a cane. Peckinpah seems willfully to be showing disdain for the material, even though he badly needed a commercial hit to match The Getaway after a couple of brilliant but poorly performing films (Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid (1973, and Bring Me the Head of Alfredo Garcia (1974)). Everyone seems to be confused, even when they're not supposed to be, and the entire script seems improvised, but not in a good way. Still, it manages to get by on star power alone, and even bad 70s thrillers are light years ahead of most made today.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Novecento on 05/21/14 at 11:09pm
Thanks for sharing - I thought it was an interview with Caan, but that reads more like a short article  :-?

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Gashade on 05/22/14 at 6:25pm
This is just a short extract of rather long and quite interesting three part conversation with Caan. Not an interview in the sense of questions and answers, but more like an article describing the encounter the author had with Caan, quoting him for the most interesting things he told him.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Novecento on 06/23/14 at 6:08pm
Did anyone else pick up a copy of the most recent issue?

In addition to Mike's short PG&BTK article, a highlight for me was the extensive interview with Friedkin on "Sorcerer" to coincide with the new North American BD. It's crazy how all that alternative footage that made itself into the European cut (while chopping out and re-ordering other stuff in the original cut) was never sanctioned by Friedkin, yet somehow editors/producers/distributors saw fit to include it. I've never seen the European version (and according to the interview, neither has Friedkin and nor does he care to), but there must be an interesting back story to this one... much like a Peckinpah film really† :)

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Gashade on 06/23/14 at 7:23pm
Yeah, it's a fantastic film.
Oh, and it has also been written by Walon Green...

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Robert Blenheim on 06/23/14 at 7:25pm

Quote:
Did anyone else pick up a copy of the most recent issue?


I have it.  It's great!   I wish the article by Mike Siegel were longer (it's good, though), but with the Friedkin-Sorcerer, Great Escape, Nancy Kwan and Wicker Man articles added, it's a worthwhile purchase.  (And, ahem, I can't get that photo of Ingrid Pitt out of my head!)

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by mike bishop on 06/24/14 at 6:00am
SORCERER: One of my favorites. I made a 'fan cut' years ago, 132 minutes, incl. the European extra footage (I only had German dubbed). It includes a great scene taken from Clouzot's film: Rabal wants to slow down on a bumpy road, Scheider wants to speed up...

A friend of mine told Friedkin about my extended cut and he seemed interested. Beyond that, I don't know. The US cut was his Director's Cut so I suppose he just didn't care and of course the 90 min. version is a bit painful to watch knowing what is missing, although it has some elegant dissolves and use of TANGERNIE's music. I can't get enough of the film, we'd need the European cut as HD then we could make our HD 'fan cut' :)

My article was supposed just to announce the GARCIA Blu-ray, I extended it slightly thanks to Lee & Dave giving it more space. It wasn't meant as a 'real' piece about the film. Maybe one day another Peckinpah 10-page Film in Focus :)

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Novecento on 06/25/14 at 8:08pm

mike bishop wrote on 06/24/14 at 6:00am:
SORCERER: One of my favorites. I made a 'fan cut' years ago, 132 minutes, incl. the European extra footage (I only had German dubbed). It includes a great scene taken from Clouzot's film: Rabal wants to slow down on a bumpy road, Scheider wants to speed up...


Comparison of cuts:

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Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by mike bishop on 06/26/14 at 4:02pm
Thanks for rescuing me...

I was asked quite a few times to compare those versions and list all the details.. I'd never find the time. It is great somebody did it, it was worth the effort and everybody can dive into it now,,

Maybe someone will do it with PAT GARRETT :).
Not me, but I just got a DVD of the (German) theatrical version. not 16:9 but at least letterbox !!

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Robert Blenheim on 06/26/14 at 4:19pm
Let me know, Mike, what the difference is between the German theatrical PG&BTK and the versions here.   And, by the way, thanks for the Alfredo Garcia article.  Yeah, it was short but excellent.

Bob

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Novecento on 07/22/14 at 8:05pm
Interesting article here on the Cinema Retro about ABC's venture into feature films. Mentions Junior Bonner and Straw Dogs (not mentioned but also broadly of note is that Noon Wine was an ABC vehicle, albeit TV)

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Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by mike bishop on 07/23/14 at 6:01am
It states that Peckinpah 'redeemed BONNER's losses with STRAW DOGS (1973)'. ??
Those winners/losers informations are never really certified. You never know where the box-office dollars end up. BONNER was a flop, sure. But whether in the end it made back its 3.4 million budget nobody knows really.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Stanton on 07/23/14 at 2:57pm
They mean The Getaway probably.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by mike bishop on 07/24/14 at 4:53am
I don't think so, GETAWAY has nothing to do with ABC. (?)
Maybe DOGS' gross is somewhere stated 'box office until 73' which is not uncommon since after a year of worldwide release one usually gets a representable number.
Just not well written/researched, it spreads wrong information. Minor case anyway.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Gashade on 07/24/14 at 6:14pm
"Even Woody Allenís magic touch deserted him..." while Take the money and run was Allen's first film. Definitely not a very good article.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Robert Blenheim on 07/24/14 at 8:02pm

Gashade wrote on 07/24/14 at 6:14pm:
"Even Woody Allenís magic touch deserted him..." while Take the money and run was Allen's first film. Definitely not a very good article.


I'll never forget the many times I laughed throughout "Take the Money and Run", as did my whole family whenever we watched it.  Sure, it's not polished or a very cohesive work, but it's funny!

"Dancing with a mailman?????"

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by mike bishop on 07/25/14 at 5:08am
Woody is among my favorite people in this world :).
Went to see him in Munich few years ago, great evening.
ANNIE HALL is among my Top 15 films. Next to CATCH 22 my favorite film without a soundtrack. As a filmmaker that this champions league to me. Take away the soundtrack of so many masterpieces, like Leone, Clockwork Orange and many others, and the film's impact is lessened dramatically. I have the highest respect for film makers who once in a while do not embrace this added comfortable zone of a musical score.
Anyway. TAKE THE MONEY was great :). (and it made money!). Him playing the cello on the streets with his chair in tow... I'm so happy they screwed up CASINO ROYALE and partly WHAT's NEW PUSSYCAT. That's when Allen said 'no more messing around with my scripts, I'd rather do it myself..'. Back then he also stated that you can learn the essentials of filmmaking in a day or so (or was it 10 minutes?). Which is true, if you have a certain intelligence and talent. He was referring to the basic film language, certain rules and laws one has to learn when telling a story with the camera.

Picture I took in Munich:
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Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Stanton on 07/27/14 at 5:25am
But all of Allen's early films are not well directed. Funny, but not well directed. That's why Play It again Sam is the best of his early films.
Love and Death shows signs of developing, but it was then Annie Hall which was the big step forward.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Robert Blenheim on 07/27/14 at 9:48am

Stanton wrote on 07/27/14 at 5:25am:
But all of Allen's early films are not well directed. Funny, but wel directed. That's why Play It again Sam is the best of his early films.


I tend to disagree with you unless 'good directing' is synonymous with conventional.† †Sure, Allen was learning on his early films, but much of the humor of "Take the Money and Run", "Bananas", "Sleeper" and "Love and Death" comes from the camera & editing.† They're not disciplined, true.† But by your standards many unconventional directors' classics fall under your 'not well directed' umbrella.† ("Vivre Sa Vie" would fall in five seconds -- but it's a masterpiece, arguably Godard's finest film.)

"Play it Again Sam" was directed by Herbert Ross, an average director of competence.† Not more than that.† I'm sorry, but I'd rather see the clumsiness of Allen running down the street with a gumball machine stuck on his hand than Ross's predictably average work.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Stanton on 07/27/14 at 1:55pm
Ross was a lesser filmmaker, but a competent enough director.

I did not mean† conventional with good directing, so this is not my standard. ;)
But unconcentinal directing is not necessarily good directing either.

In the end it depends on the individual films. In Allen's early films the directing appears to be "wrong" for me.

Title: Re: Cinema Retro
Post by Gashade on 04/23/16 at 5:10pm
This has nothing to do with Peckinpah, but Mike has just published a piece on Enter the Dragon in the new Cinema Retro issue:
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